I need everyone I've helped to help

DR928;10807 wrote: In case you have forgotten, I resigned as an 928OC Officer and webmaster just so ONE additional 928 Vendor would pledge their support to the 928OC. I did that FOR the 928OC, not for me, or my company.

This sounds like a dream you had Dave. When I took over 9 years ago, there was nothing happening, the website was static. I have no idea what vendor you are referring to. It took me many years to get 928 Int'l to consider an involvement at Sharktoberfest, it certainly wasn't right after you resigned. Devek never came on board because of the bad blood that existed before I took on this role. It was years before I was able to put most of the bad feelings for claimed shirts not received, for members questioning what was done with their membership fees, etc.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10818 wrote: Actually you forget, prior to my being president I developed the website, and the agreement was that my business name would be on the website. Sorry to hear your memory is selective.

I do not remember that, and as the loudest proponent of having no advertising on the 928OC website, I remember it very differently. I do remember you being offered to be listed in the "Vendor Directory" that is all.

But, even if you think you remember it otherwise, or even if I remember it wrong, it sure shows your pure dedication to the 928 Owners Club by making that a condition and then plastering it all over everything.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10818 wrote: I have never been paid for maintenance to the website or for the services I provide in the installation and development of the web forum.

OK, I could be wrong, since the accounting posted for members to see is just one line genreic info, I may have mistakenly assumed who the $480 a year for "Web Hosting etc" is sent too. If that is not you, please enlighten us as to why we are paying that yearly sum to someone else if you have "never been paid" as you vaguely imply.

You see Stan, you are playing that game of "words" I never said anything about maintenance to the website or for the services"... I said HOSTING SERVICE...and someone is being paid for that according to the 928OC Expense report...again, if not you, who? and if you are graciaously doing it all for free..WHY is the OC spending $480 a year for nothing?

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10818 wrote: Don't intentionally mislead people. Seems to be a trend of yours, mislead then say that isn't what you meant.

See above, it's your "trend" not mine.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10818 wrote: Whomever takes on the website maintenance if Andrew wins, is welcome to take off my business name.

OH, so if YOUR Candidate wins, the Excell advertising stays.... and you will continue to help the 928OC with website stuff....BUT, if Andrew wins you take your ball and go home and refuse to help the 928OC.....I understand more and more each post you make....so do many others.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10821 wrote: So, because I am the only one willing to run the election, I should lose my right to speak about my record? Rather than question the dishonesty about my record, I should sit back and allow others to disparage it, along with my moral character?

Quite a big load you want me to carry Dave. I have been carrying the load for 9 years. I don't want any pity. I don't even want appreciation. I want the 928 OC to be recognized for what it is. A *thriving* financially sound club that grew 40% in two years. It is being maliciously maligned based on fiction, and you are supporting that.

No, I will not give up my right to speak out simply because I took on the load of running the elections. Again, the elections would *not* exist *ever* were it not for my initiative and efforts. The people on the sidelines questioning it all, will quickly quiet down again when volunteers are sought. It happened just 2 years ago.

Those who have worked with me on the 928 OC board, and that includes you Dave, have *not* offered to work an election or nomination.

Sorry, but your expectations, as many of the "would be" members is laughable. I have been here for 9 years, and those who come through when there is work to be done are *very* few. I treasure those people, and will defend them quite vigorously.

I will *not* give my right to speak out in exchange for being some kind of worker drone for the 928 OC.

Stan,

You asked the question, and I answered it honestly, period.

NOBODY here has disparaged your character, we were trying to let you know YOU WHERE.

Fine, you are too good to not speak out at the expense of the 928OC, your choice, but you and the 928OC are reaping the "rewards" of that decision.

I do like how you selectively tout the last 2 years, what about the 7 before? It seems you want to take credit for the "40% increase" that is clearly as you even say, James doing as Membership Chair (thanks James).

I have been trying to tell you that a lot of the reason you lack volunteers is because of your attitude. You have personally "ran off" top level 928 people who DID volunteer to help, did what they were asked to do and then blown off. Sadly the OC has lost a lot of great 928 people because of how you treat and act towards them. I have tried to tell you this in a constructive way and even blamed it on your length of service, not you.

I know you say you don't remember the discussion of updating the front end of the website when I was a trustee..remember or not, you got defensive as if we were insulting the current look and shut it down before we even had a chance to volunteer.

I do find it interesting you seem to DEMAND worker drones and jump all over anyone that even good heartedly questions your decisions and actions, but yet refuse to temporarily give up spewing negativity for the good of the 928OC during a short election cycle.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10825 wrote: This sounds like a dream you had Dave.

Nice Stan. You are obviously clueless and know nothing about this. Ed Ruiz knows, Leonard Laub knows, so do many others. The only dreaming around here is from you.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10825 wrote: I have no idea what vendor you are referring to.

That is right, you don't, so in perfect "Stan style" you say I am dreaming.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10825 wrote: It took me many years to get 928 Int'l to consider an involvement at Sharktoberfest,

928 International was fully behind the OC when I was one of the ones in control.. Wonder why it took you years to get them to accept money for Sharktoberfest?? Most anyone else could have done that with one phone call.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10825 wrote: Devek never came on board because of the bad blood that existed before I took on this role.

I won't speak to that, but you if you really knew ANYTHING about this, then you would be in my "dream" too.

Stan.Shaw@Excell.Net;10823 wrote: Thanks Austin, that is what I have heard, the valve caps are a nice addition, and the duffel bag is wonderful for carrying the 928 essential emergency kit. The first aid kit is similarly nice. And contrary to Dave's opinion of us buying off members, each item is a recruiting tool, as members are reminded of just 1 of the things the 928 OC does, and can easily share it with prospective member. Similarly the mementos that each sponsored event must provide with our logo, reminds members what we have done. I was told the collection display at the OCIC was quite impressive.

Forgive me for point out, all of these methods are a way of building the club and providing value to members.

Do members who sign up really want to spend $19,000 plus (2004-2009) on "gifts" back to them on their dues of $53,000 plus(2004-2009) and think this is best use of their dues for furthering 928 Ownership?? AND, this has netted us 3 years after this spending for a grand total of now only 500-600 Members.OMG?? I shudder to think what the spending for 2010-2012 was.

If they say they are OK with that, I will never mention it again.

Do members really think spending this $19,000(2004-2009) plus VERSUS spending only $18,000 plus(2004-2009) sponsoring 928 Events is OK??

Again, If they say they are OK with that, I will never mention it again.

Disclaimer or "Data Point": Sponsorship spent was $21,000 plus if you add the $3500 sponsorship money for the 2004, 2006, and 2009 Owners Club International Conventions. Still makes it $19,000 for gifts versus $21,000 for Event Sponsorships.

Do members really feel this is the best way to spend these funds?? Especially when we only have 2 Loaner Tools, total costing less than $700 or so.

Personally I would think a SharkTuner (just a wild example, not a suggestion) in every region... would be better than $1800+ worth of "Tireclocks", $4100+ worth of Duffle Bags and T-shirts, $2700+ of Keychains, $1800 for Caps, $1200 for Cupholders, and on and on (just for 2004-2009).

Again, this is just my opinion, and Stan feel free to data check me on this, FWIW I didn't trust my memory to add it up, someone did it for me.

It is the Members Club, and honestly if the majority of the Members truly feel this type of fiscal responsibility is OK with them, and is how they want to use their combined resources and dues to Further and Enhance 928 Ownership and to support the Porsche 928 for the future..fine, again, I will never speak of it again..and will accept that and STFU forever.

Just to clarify for anyone not clearly paying attention. Dave is attempting to prosecute me, primarily for his lack of knowledge, and involvement in the club. One should note I am not running for a board position. Does anyone question why Dave came to this discussion?

Is it to provide details of how Andrew will succeed? Is it to apologize for having done nothing, even when on the board, to initiate or develop programs. No, Dave is simply here to prosecute me, without any basis.

DR928;10826 wrote: I do not remember that, and as the loudest proponent of having no advertising on the 928OC website, I remember it very differently. I do remember you being offered to be listed in the "Vendor Directory" that is all.

But, even if you think you remember it otherwise, or even if I remember it wrong, it sure shows your pure dedication to the 928 Owners Club by making that a condition and then plastering it all over everything.

You can review all the archives Dave, I was just a member and offered the 928 OC a deep discount to develop a website. The offer was contingent on my listing my business on all pages, as we do for many customers. Ed Ruiz agreed. You probably don't recall, as your involvement was nearly always missing. That is why Leonard Laub approached me to take on the job.

Again, just an attack on my character, without fact, and having nothing to do with the election.

DR928;10826 wrote: OK, I could be wrong, since the accounting posted for members to see is just one line genreic info, I may have mistakenly assumed who the $480 a year for "Web Hosting etc" is sent too. If that is not you, please enlighten us as to why we are paying that yearly sum to someone else if you have "never been paid" as you vaguely imply.

I didn't vaguely imply anything Dave. You just need to *read* what I wrote, it was as clear as I provide on our invoices. I said:
"I have never been paid for maintenance to the website or for the services I provide in the installation and development of the web forum"

We have always charged for hosting, and have never adjusted the value of the hosting since the agreement, when I was *not* president. You and Ed agreed to the hosting fee. In my version of a "blind trust" there has been no change to that charge regardless of the disk space it took up.

Again, just an attack on my character, without fact, and having nothing to do with the election.

DR928;10826 wrote: You see Stan, you are playing that game of "words" I never said anything about maintenance to the website or for the services"... I said HOSTING SERVICE...and someone is being paid for that according to the 928OC Expense report...again, if not you, who? and if you are graciaously doing it all for free..WHY is the OC spending $480 a year for nothing?

See above, it's your "trend" not mine.

I am sorry that you are having difficult understanding the words I am saying, but it is your memory that is lacking.

Anyone bothering to consider facts would wonder why, in all you years of support of the 928 OC, and your time on the 928 OC board, you never asked these questions. Well, it is clear to any rational being that you have chosen to try and twist your memory as it suits you. Really Dave, with all your dedication to the 928 OC, why do you bring this up now, when you *were* in the position of *trustee* and it was then your duty to question it. This is further evidence of how you are trying to have a positive approach, right? Attack Brad without even a nominal understanding of what you speak. And of course full bore at me. Dave, admit it, you are simply trying to tear down what you yourself could not do.

Again, just an attack on my character, without fact, and having nothing to do with the election.

DR928;10826 wrote: OH, so if YOUR Candidate wins, the Excell advertising stays.... and you will continue to help the 928OC with website stuff....BUT, if Andrew wins you take your ball and go home and refuse to help the 928OC.....I understand more and more each post you make....so do many others.

There has never been a desire on my part to work with Andrew. The board has known this for at least two years. To imply I need to stay on, or "I am taking my ball and going home" is attempting to treat me as a slave to the 928 OC. I have stated many times I want to retire.

Dave, you were super moderator once, and I am sure you have endeared all the members who are reading your tirades, so perhaps *YOU* will step up and do the forum and website work. You don't need me. You can step up and put some time in. Time you have *never* put in to this club, unless at an event promoting your business.

If James wants me to take down the advertising, I will be happy to do so. I have not held the site captive, there hasn't been anyone, including you Dave, who would step forward to do just that one part of what I do. MIA is what Brad said, and it is on target.

I fully expect the site to move away if Andrew wins, and that is fine. It is an over serviced and under valued customer.

Just another character attack Dave. You keep working on it, when you move your "fact" game up to the A level you might have a chance with me. Otherwise I will just keep taking you apart fictitious statement after statement.

Good to see you showing up so suddenly to add a *positive* atmosphere to the environment.